Catcher in the Argot

Saturday, May 05, 2007

How to lose a debate on 9/11 conspiracy theories

Have fun with your fantasy! Next time you're trying to assert that 9/11 was an inside job, mark this Bingo scorecard, and when you have used 5 fallacious arguments in a row, you'll know when to back down in defeat. (Or you can go and use the same argument in another forum, having not learned anything, as you do.)

The kind and clever poster Minadin (from the James Randi Educational Foundation's forum) helped me create it, using my Truther Credo as a guide. Thankyou , Minadin.

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  • read tarpley first, write then.
    see 911Ripple effect, or 911Mysteries part1 demolitions, and write then.
    hear firefighter's testimonies, or live footage near the WTC, and write then.
    smell the cordite (one documented testimony) near the pentagone, and write then.
    touch, if you ever can, one single piece of the 767 that allegedly mysteriously ghostly hit the groung near Shanksville, and write then.

    the question is NOT how to demonize or ridiculise people who show the way (even if they sometimes look like buddies out of a circus ), but how and when justice will be done. The unbearable truth is that our intelligence services around the world KNOW the truth, but fear to face it, because the evil, i.e. the mafia is still in their rows and moreover in key positions. The elites don't trust the people who elected them, or gave them money (which is the same in the US by the way, alas). These corrupted elites (not all of them)dispise the people. They dispise the "We the people..." All of this stinks. it stinks the oil, the green banknote, and big weaponry. Go on and think for yourself: Are we safer, one million dead people after 911 events? (and more for sure, knowing for example that any GI dead out of any "direct war action", for example after having been wounded, is not included!!! NO OF COURSE.

    Allright, I was just passing by... be back in a few years, when you have dug the question seriously, without considering that, for the first time in the history of the world, and in the history of international political affairs, a governement would have told the truth to its people!!!

    forgive my English, writing from far away... BLUE

    By Blogger Blue, at Thursday, 3 January 2008 at 9:53:00 am AEDT  

  • Hello I just entered before I have to leave to the airport, it's been very nice to meet you, if you want here is the site I told you about where I type some stuff and make good money (I work from home): here it is

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at Friday, 18 January 2008 at 8:00:00 am AEDT  

  • Blue, sorry, I didn't see your comment until now.

    For a start, you should watch "Screw 911 Mysteries" or read That will give you an idea of how you are deluding yourself by swallowing 9/11 conspiracy fallacies whole.

    You don't have to love the US government to doubt 9/11 conspiracy theories.

    By Blogger orphia_nay, at Sunday, 20 April 2008 at 3:51:00 pm AEST  

  • I know all of this, of course, but does it matter? Just look close to the images, and check with Richard Gage powerpoint all possibilities for the WTC's collapse, then eliminate all of them that do not match with images, and without sound you get the very same result.

    And then: what about those 100+ testimonies, about explosions, W Rodriguez first? Are all of these people nuts? Do they deserve instant asylum? Even the journalists right on the place, told us about explosions, before their comments are switched for inside views coming from their obedient desks... All of this stinks, believe me... What about the firefighters commenting series of explosions like machine gun's ones? everybody has seen this video footage (fake for you may be?) .

    And don't tell me that some explosive material (but no Thermate or whatever combination of controlled demolition explosives) did explode, like gas or electricity devices or fuel tanks: none of these sources could even scratch a single steel beam of the WTC. Can you imagine what 47 main central beams plus 2 or 300 smaller ones around are? You need an extreme force to desintegrate ALL of them at the same time, at the same pace, at the same speed (North tower especially). That's just common sense, and statistics, not deluding myself. And yes, primarily explosions at the base occur well in advance but the building still stands, fragilised, waiting for the final breakdown..

    More and more people start talking, that's just a matter of time. Ask Barbara Honegger, Sibel Edmonds, Colleen Rowley, all the people in ZERO, investigation on September 11th, the new european movie made by european parliament deputy Chiesa (member of the commission about secret questioning of terrorists by the CIA on european soil... nuts, probably too, like the 1200+ secret flights of the CIA over our european territories, with landings in Portugal Spain, Poland...for the veru same issue, this time unveiled by Dick Marty, a swiss deputy member of the european council).

    This file stinks like never. And since it has played the role of an icon for entering in the new century, it deserves the truth, or something near of it, not the vast amount of mysteries, mistakes, missing parts, lies, alleged accusations unproved, etc .that build the officicial theory until now.

    Is it the kind of answer you need to read? Or are you too involved in politically correct thinking for just having the silly idea of trying to understand what the people have to say, and what it means? The truth movement counts now millions of people around the world, that's a fact. HAlf of the US citizens want an investigation about what the governement did or not... Zogbypolls, 9/07.... etc.etc.


    By Blogger bluerider1, at Monday, 21 April 2008 at 8:52:00 am AEST  

  • “Explosions” do not always mean “explosives”. How else can you describe the sound of the towers collapsing? Almost all those witnesses were describing the collapse, not bombs. And the explosion Rodriguez heard was the sound of jet fuel exploding down an elevator shaft.

    What on earth is the point of detonating explosives at the base of a building if you’re then going to bring the building down from the top down? Think about it.

    Watch real controlled demolitions. The explosives explode, then you hear the sound of the collapse. Where are the two separate sounds on 9/11?

    “Can you imagine what 47 main central beams plus 2 or 300 smaller ones around are? You need an extreme force to desintegrate ALL of them at the same time, at the same pace, at the same speed (North tower especially).”

    The floor beams of the impact/fire area were heat-weakened and sagged, and the perimeter columns bowed out, thus it just took the extreme weight of the floors above to start the total collapse.

    The “Truth” movement is dying. It peaked with 9/11/06 and Loose Change 2nd Edition, and has been waning ever since. See:

    You can support further investigation into 9/11 and not believe in hush-a-boom explosives. A Zogby poll last year showed only 4.6% believe in controlled demolition.

    By Blogger orphia_nay, at Monday, 21 April 2008 at 5:36:00 pm AEST  

  • can't die, the families of the victims still stand up. and the world is concerned, not the us only.

    watch a controlled demolition: explosions at the base before final breakdown.

    watch Oboken (Hoboken?)videos: dust at the base before final breakdown.

    At the WTC, in order to mask the demolition, a long sequence has been organised, for example in the north building just when the 2nd plane hits...

    what about Kevin Ryan testimony, from Underwriters laboratories? HAve heard about this guy?

    what WTC7 ?

    and again, no fuel tank can provide such an explosion like the one Rodriguez and a black guy experienced together before AA11 impact...

    By Blogger bluerider1, at Monday, 21 April 2008 at 7:04:00 pm AEST  

  • Kevin Ryan the Waterboy? Don't make me laugh.

    Hoboken? Dust at the base an hour before collapse? Oh, really?

    Rodriguez? WTC7?

    By Blogger orphia_nay, at Monday, 21 April 2008 at 7:40:00 pm AEST  

  • So, Orphia, its a bit odd for someone who claims to be a skeptic/sceptic to have an ongoing friendship with a guy who actively helped twoofers push their con. He's friends with one twoofer's kid, brainwashed from birth apparently. Either the kid believes in the twoof and is now a little twoofer zombie, and he helped make them this way, or, the kid learned its okay to scam people if your parent and friends are doing it. Which isn't much better.

    But the awkward thing for you, Orphia, is you watched with garbage go down on Facebook in real time. And you still defended this guy years after. No, its worse than that: you pretended you didn't know he was working with racist, sleazy twoofer scammers.

    Yes, there is proof. No, it doesn't matter if you're not Stateside. Promoting a fraud internationally is still fraud. Starting a thread inviting ex-twoofers to share, knowing they will be targets of racist, tea bagger, violent loons if they do, makes it look like you are part of the problem.

    Are you part of the problem? Or are you one of those codependents who have a blind spot for picking really shitting friends?

    That's the question.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at Monday, 12 October 2015 at 9:13:00 am AEDT  


    By Anonymous Anonymous, at Monday, 12 October 2015 at 9:44:00 am AEDT  

  • So, that's a blind spot for codependent friendships. It's ironic considering your past, or maybe that's why--you latched on to the first people who gave you validation once you got your head straight.

    But you still have no moral compass. If you did, you and your friends wouldn't try to out people who left the twoofer con.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at Monday, 12 October 2015 at 12:33:00 pm AEDT  

  • And then there's the disingenuous or clueless(hard to tell which) assumptions among some skeptics that there are "schisms" or "infighting" among troofers. If you've been around long enough you know it's a scam so all "schisms" are also scams to better sell twooferism as "grassroots".

    The reality is many listed in the current schism are associates of Richard Gage.

    The warring parties are:
    *) David Chandler (yes-plane, probably even AA77) and his minions
    Frank Legge
    Jonathan Cole
    John Wyndham
    Jim Hoffman
    Ken Jenkins
    Kevin Ryan
    John Farmer

    *) Craig McKee (no-plane) and his minions
    Ken Freeland
    Adam Ruff
    Adam Syed
    Massimo Mazzucco
    James Hufferd
    Paul Zarembka

    Craig McKee writes for AE911truth. He would be aware the people running 911blogger are also involved with AE911Truth. Yet he hosts Syed and others alleged suspicious of 911blogger being "shills". How fake can you get?

    And the first group has two persons involved with the Bentham Paper fraud, which McKee's group supports. HELLO, is anyone paying attention? There is no schism. Just the latest ploy in the con, scams 101: make and control your own branding.

    Leading us to the real question: when are skeptics, especially former AE911truth members, going to file formal reports of fraud to the FBI or FTC or whoever and not just sit around acting superior? When did informing the public about conspiracy scammers turn into an arm chair spectator sport? If you're not prepared to send all these fuckers to Federal prison, what use are you people?

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at Tuesday, 13 October 2015 at 7:46:00 am AEDT  

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